Jada Edwards & Jennie Allen Message Review (IF:Gathering Series Pt.3- Teaching)

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Season 2 Episode 7 Transcript

Introduction: 

Hello ladies and welcome to another episode of Thoroughly Equipped. So glad you could join me today and if you are new, welcome. We are trudging on ahead with a critique on the very popular women’s conference the IF:Gathering. If this is your first time listening I highly suggest you first go to my trailer for Thoroughly Equipped and then dive into the first of this series on IF, which is Episode 3 of this season, which is season 2.

 In the first part of this critiques series I present to you the heart or purpose of IF:Gathering and we compare their goal in discipleship to Scripture’s goal in discipleship. I had the intent of diving straight into looking at the ministries of the popular female speakers that are platformed in the conference so I could give you guys a litmus test by which to judge who’s authority they put themselves under, and realized that I probably should make a case for the first question in the test, and that is do they preach and teach over men in the church service. So the 2nd episode in the series deals with what Scripture says in regard to this. In the 3rd episode of the series I presented to you the litmus test and these women’s ministries, books, speaking engagements and activities within popular Evangelicalism today. In the last episode of this series I wanted to present to you a case by George Whitfield on why we should always be about knowing Christ. And today’s episode is about the way these speakers handle Scripture in the conference.

Now to really hone in on this, I’m going to go back to the 2020 conference. And that’s because, in this conference Mrs. Allen decided to have each of the speakers give a message on Romans 8, splitting the chapter into sections from which they will teach. And, yes, we are going to address each message. To lay out for you how I’m going to tackle this I will present the speaker, read the passage that they are supposedly teaching on, and then give you a synopsis of what they spoke about. I’m going to be far and address what I felt was good and then play for you clips where there are issues and problematic teachings. If you are able, I highly suggest you grab your bible and open up to Romans. We are going to be going though referencing through more than just chapter 8 because this chapter is not to be read in a vacuum, but is in the context of a letter written to the Romans on the Christian faith, and more specific to this chapter, the contrast between those who walk in the flesh and those who walk in the Spirit.

To start…I’m going to play for you a clip from the 2020 Conference introduction given by Jennie Allen herself, talking about her vision for that year’s conference. (Play Intro clip 1)

She portrays a desire that the audience come to know Jesus and proclaim Jesus to the world. So as I present to you their messages, keep this in mind and observe how much they talk about Him and proclaim Him. She continues discussing her hopes for the women attending: (Play Intro clip 2)

1. She believes it is the mission of God’s people to change the world. I want to bring to your attention that the mission of the Church is to make disciples of Christ- to baptize them in the name of the Father, SOn, and Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that He has commanded (Matt. 28:19-20).

The goal is not to change the world, but to save individuals from God’s wrath to come. God’s wrath is against the world and the world knows it and it hates God. Christ states this in John 15:18-25 “If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first. 19 If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you. 20 Remember what I told you: ‘A servant is not greater than his master.’ If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they will obey yours also. 21 They will treat you this way because of my name, for they do not know the one who sent me. 22 If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not be guilty of sin; but now they have no excuse for their sin. 23 Whoever hates me hates my Father as well. 24 If I had not done among them the works no one else did, they would not be guilty of sin. As it is, they have seen, and yet they have hated both me and my Father. 25 But this is to fulfill what is written in their Law: ‘They hated me without reason.’

The world wants change, but change done it’s way. It wants change without God, without repentance of their sin, and without the work of Christ. It does not want to be reconciled to God, as it hates the Father. The problem with popular evangelicalism today, is that it wants to comply with the world’s way of changing instead of God’s way of changing. And I fully am convinced, now that the IF:Gathering does exactly that. That is one of the things I wish to present to you in the future critique of this series. (Play Intro clip 3)

So  in that clip that she acknowledges that there may be people in the audience who are “just checking Jesus out”. That would imply that unbelievers are in the audience. And she emphasizes how they will go through Roman chapter 8 and will leave with more of Jesus. So I want to see if the Gospel is actually presented. Do any of the speakers present our problem and placard Christ as our only hope? Romans is the PERFECT place to go to get a thorough proclamation of both these things. But Romans 8, if not handled in context and twisted, can easily lead an unbeliever that they are right with God, WITHOUT acknowledging their sin, their repentance of their sin, and their need for a savior because of their sin. The majority of the book of Romans itself is proclaiming our problem and need for Christ. So let’s keep this in mind as well, to observe if they are taught that they are sinners under God’s judgment, and are urged to trust in Christ and His work for the forgiveness of their sins.

The 2020 conference is a perfect opportunity to show how these women handle Scripture. Do they draw out from the scripture, in context, what the Holy Spirit, through Paul, wishes to teach us? Or do they take certain verses, words or concepts out of their context so they may interject what they want to teach? Do they talk more about themselves, their stories, or do they talk about Christ and His work? Do they talk rightly talk about sin so that they can rightly give the Gospel? Do they make the Gospel more about God’s great love for you, His pursuit of you, and His plan for you without first explaining our sinful nature, our state as children of wrath, who have no hope without trusting in the finished work of Christ? Do they exalt Christ and His work, because by it we have no other hope, or do they treat the Gospel as something of the past and now we need motivational, engaging, speeches to live as Christians. Do they not only proclaim by words that the Scriptures are authoritative, without error and sufficient to train us unto righteousness, but ACT on that belief by teaching from the Scriptures, handling it with honor in its context, urging their listeners to look to it to thoroughly equip them for all good works? Or do they dishonor it and minimize its necessity to equip us by adding their own philosophies, examples, and opinions?

Let’s really look at the way they handle scripture.

The first session centered on Rom. 8 was a message delivered by Jada Edwards on verse 1-4.

START HERE

Let’s look at the text Rom 8:1-4

There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.² For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death. ³ For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, ⁴ in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

Mrs Edwards starts her message on a story mourning the loss of a sports star who recently (in 2020) had passed away. She uses the story to dive into the theme of her message: How the world views Christianity and its answer to the problem of evil in the world. She rightly points out that people come to Christianity thinking it will fulfill our worldly needs. (Play clip 1)

Ok, so how true is that!  it is exactly what I did in my own religious life. And I’m super impressed that she would point this out. I wish, tho, that she would call it what it is. Pride, sin, doubt in God’s sovereignty and goodness. R.C. Sproul describes these people as wanting the blessings of God but not wanting God Himself. And that is so true of so many people in the purpose driven, pragmatic, and prosperity gospel churches. They come to God for blessings, whether that be the blessing of purpose, security, success, material possessions, successful marriages, health and wealth, not understanding their deepest need God Himself.

After describing in her life how she has to, at times, remind her kids that the provisions of candy, sleeping on a mattress, eating dinner, etc are treats, she explains how we sometimes don’t understand that God has supplied our greatest need making all other things treats. It is after explaining this that she dives into the text. Now, I really appreciated that she went into what Paul wrote before chapter 8, because it’s in these chapters that our sinful nature is laid bare for us and Christ’s work is argued as our only salvation. And she points out that there is bad news that comes before this good news that we receive in chapter 8. (play clip 2)

I can appreciate whatr she is saying in this clip. But there is something I want to point out in the 2nd to last statement she states there…that Paul, in chapter 7 is conveying that he  “is a mess” and has internal conflict. That’s only half the issue. Let’s look at this portion in chapter 7 and we’re going to start in verse13 and read through to 23.

¹³ Did that which is good, then, bring death to me? By no means! It was sin, producing death in me through what is good, in order that sin might be shown to be sin, and through the commandment might become sinful beyond measure. ¹⁴ For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am of the flesh, sold under sin. ¹⁵ For I do not understand my own actions. For I do not do what I want, but I do the very thing I hate. ¹⁶ Now if I do what I do not want, I agree with the law, that it is good. ¹⁷ So now it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells within me. ¹⁸ For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh. For I have the desire to do what is right, but not the ability to carry it out. ¹⁹ For I do not do the good I want, but the evil I do not want is what I keep on doing. ²⁰ Now if I do what I do not want, ^cit is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells within me. (here is the specific text that she is probably referencing):

²¹ So I find it to be a law that when I want to do right, evil lies close at hand. ²² For I delight in the law of God, in my inner being, ²³ but I see in my members another law waging war against the law of my mind and making me captive to the law of sin that dwells in my members. Wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself, serve the law of God with my mind, but with my flesh I serve the law of sin.

So we really need to take notice of what Paul is describing here. That our sinful nature, our fleshly passions are what drive us to sin, and the law is good and spiritual and right, and by it our sins are brought to light and exposed. So Paul is describing an internal conflict but not merely an internal one, but a conflict of the Spirit against the flesh. In his mind he agrees with the LAW of God, the commands of God, that they should be obeyed and fulfilled, but his flesh fights him and produces sinful acts. That’s what he means by I see in my members another law waging war against the law of my mind and making me captive to the law of sin that dwells in my members. And that he serves the law of God with his mind but with his flesh serves the law of sin.

Here is the way Mrs. Edwards describes the conflict (Play clip 3). 

No, the internal struggle is not like justifying eating something that is bad for you. It’s the struggle not to sin because sin is rebellion against the God who created us, against the divine man who lived and died for us, and it quenches the Spirit that dwells within us. 

Why do I make a point in clarifying this? Because this will become a common theme in each and every message given by the speakers. That our conflict is a battle of the mind and our sin is trivial. But we see from this passage and Rom.8 that the battle is between the Spirit and the flesh. For the Christian the mind delights in the law of God, internally, but our flesh fights us to keep us from fulfilling the law, causing us to sin. So there are internal and outward actions being talked about here. But IF:Gathering will make it all about internal issues, such as lack of confidence, control, comparison, lack of joy and hope, fear, not feeling accepted, etc; instead of our struggle with sin and obedience to the law.

Is it intentional? I believe it is. Why do I make that conclusion? Because, while they did read ALL of chapter 8 in the beginning of the conference, the specific passages referencing the flesh; how it cannot submit to God’s law, how we are not to set our minds on the flesh and are to put it to death (sins. Rom.8:13); these verses are either twisted or ignored entirely by the speakers in messages given. 

Going back to Jada’s message, she continues in teaching us that we will have conflict and conviction as well, where she then goes on to relay how God may speak to us at times, convicting us of certain things. Her examples of times she’s been convicted are again very trivial, describing where she thinks God has told her to be quiet, or where He brought Scripture to her mind to which she thought it was to correct someone else but he says it is actually for her.  I actually find this funny, as if only certain portions of Scripture are to be applied to her at certain times, as if they are not for her at ALL times.

And then she talks about being IN Christ Jesus means those who follow Christ Jesus. Instead of drawing out from Scripture what it means to follow Christ, she talks about society’s idea of following people on social media to clarify that to follow Jesus doesn’t mean what the world makes it to be but that it means that one is committed and has made Jesus Lord. 

She rightfully points out that it’s only in Christ Jesus that we find freedom (play clip 4).

This is where she could go right back into the text of Rom.8:1-4 and draw out HOW Christ has given us freedom and from what. There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death. ³ For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, ⁴ in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. We were set free from the condemnation that is rightfully due to us because we did not keep God’s law. Which is why Christ came in the likeness of sinful flesh to fulfill the righteous requirement of the law for us. It is Christ’s active obedience imputed or credited to us that sets us free from the law of sin and death. That is why we are free. Mrs. Edwards does not go into this but continues with the practicality of our freedom and how we do not need to justify or defend our lives to others, and encouraging us not to hide when life is happening, because since Christ set us free from eternal condemnation, he can certainly set us free from earthly condemnation.

She then appeals to 2 types of people in the audience who may not be convinced of the truth of this gospel and then presents it to us…(play clip 5)

I have to squabble on this…but we are talking about the Gospel here. THE GOOD NEWS. and she got the problem right, pointing out that we were in rebellion against God, but God’s solution or action to fix the problem was not that He pursued us, though it was all His work and is a gift He gives to us. His solution was to He send His Son to live in perfect obedience to the law to fulfill the law for us and then willingly got to the cross, taking our sin upon Himself, becoming sin who knew NO sin, so that in Him we might become the righteousness of God (2 Corin. 5:21). To minimize the work of Christ to mere pursuit, leaving out the actual work in accomplishing our reconciliation to God is to not present the Gospel at all. And we know that there are unbelievers in this conference who NEED to hear what Christ did to make us right with God. 

She then encourages us to encourage others into this gospel, challenging them not to alter this word, because it’s uncomfortable or inconvenient, yet, she herself altered it in a way, minimizing the work of Christ to mere “pursuing us”. And she really hammers this, you can even hear the emotion in her voice. If she had presented the Gospel fully, I would have been right there getting emotional and shouting “Amen!” in my spirit. And I get, we can misspeak, and forget points in the moment, but that is why it is best to exegete the text. If she had merely done that she would have drawn out from the text and other Scripture passages the full Gospel, ESPECIALLY in Romans because that is what it is all about.

 I tell ya, I like Jada Edwards. From previous sermons of hers I think she grasps Scriptural truths and would be a great teacher to women if she focused on exegeting the Scripture more than making it relatable through stories and experiences; as well as being a beautiful testimony to the Authority of Scripture if she submitted to it’s instruction for women. She’s funny, quick witted, and engaging, yet she regularly peaches and teaches to a mixed congregation in her church. But that is par-the-course for most of the speakers at the IF:Gathering.

Jennie Allen Rom.8:5-8

The next message we are going to tackle is Jennie Allen’s message on Rom. 8:5-8. So let’s look at that passage before we dive into the message. Let’s look at it in context including verses 1-4 as well. (read Rom.8:1-8)

So remember, just a bit ago we looked at what Paul was talking about at the end of Chapter 7. In which, he is explaining how the Spirit wrestles with the flesh. That the law is spiritual but the flesh is sold under sin, therefore he does not understand his own actions. That in his mind he is agreeing with the law, that it is good. And yet, he does not accomplish the law. He has the desire to do what is right, obey the law, but the evil he does not want to do he keeps on doing. He delights in the law of God, in his inner being, but he sees in his members another law that wages war against the mind, making him captive to the law of sin that dwells in his members. It is because he delights in God’s law and wishes to obey it that he cries out in desperation that he is wretched because he is in need of a righteousness that is not his own so that he may be reconciled to God. And it is from identifying this need that the Gospel rescues us from condemnation. That’s where chapter 8 is taking off…(read Rom. 8:1-8)

There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. ² For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death. ³ For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin,³ he condemned sin in the flesh, ⁴ in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. ⁵ For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit. ⁶ For to set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace. ⁷ For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God’s law; indeed, it cannot. ⁸ Those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

Ok, clearly, in context, Paul is talking about the war between the Spirit and the flesh, the inability of the flesh to be able to obey or submit to God’s law, for it cannot. But those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on things of the Spirit. But what does it mean by setting the mind on the Spirit? That’s what I want you to keep in mind, because this is what Mrs. Allen’s message is all about. The question tho, is: What does Mrs Allen say “setting our mind on the Spirit is”? Is it the same as what Scripture describes here?

So let’s dive in..

Right off the bat she states that this passage is about what it means to “set the mind” and that God gave her an analogy to be used. She reads the text UP to verse 7 and explains that what we set our minds on is what we are going to think about. 

She recites verse 7 and 8 but moves on to say that we do not have life and peace without Jesus, and states we have another “storyline” if we have Jesus, one who sets their mind on the Spirit. Now this is where her analogy comes in: (I’ll describe it for those listening through the podcast) On the stage she has two basketball hoops, one on either side of the stage. She describes that one side is setting the mind on the flesh and the other hoop is setting our mind on the Spirit. She proceeds to throw the basketball at the “flesh” hoop, listing off certain fleshly things such as success, career, riches, pleasures, etc as she aims for the net. She then proceeds to the opposite side and then asks people to tell her what a person looks like who has set their mind on the Spirit. Check out what they say..(play JAllen clip 1)

Ok, so she has set it up to describe a person who has set their mind on the Spirit as looking like one who has peace, hope, confidence, etc. And this sounds legit, doesn’t it, but there is a slight problem and I will get into that in a bit, but first let’s see where she goes with the analogy. 

So she’s throwing the basketball into the net to make the point that someone who sets their mind on the Spirit will make the net. And then (for those of you listening by podcast) a group of women circle her and block her from making the net. Here’s the clip (play JAllen clip 2)

So by her analogy, she is trying to draw out that there are things that keep us from making that “net”. That if we set our minds to being peaceful, hopeful, confident we as the church should be accomplishing that. Here’s the problem: Is this what Paul means by “setting our minds on the Spirit”? Is it a conflict between good and evil and choosing peace, hope, joy, etc other than worldly things? Nope.

All throughout the letter to the Romans Paul has been describing how ALL men are under the wrath of God because they DO NOT submit to God’s law. He is not saying our problem is that we pursue material things, success, careers, riches, and we only need to pursue peace, love and joy. These certainly are things we need to address. But in this passage he is talking about something way more specific, obeying the law of God. Another issue in twisting “setting our minds on the Spirit” to mean this is that she has made these things (peace, hope, love, kindness, etc) LAW. Things one must strive for as a Christian. But they are not Law, they are fruits. They are a result of our freedom in the Gospel. The results of those who have crucified the flesh. Gal.5:13-24 expounds upon this even more. (Read Gal 5:13-24)

¹³ For you were called to freedom, brothers. Only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another. ¹⁴ For the whole law is fulfilled in one word: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” ¹⁵ But if you bite and devour one another, watch out that you are not consumed by one another.

¹⁶ But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. ¹⁷ For the desires of the flesh are against the Spirit, and the desires of the Spirit are against the flesh, for these are opposed to each other, to keep you from doing the things you want to do. ¹⁸ But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. ¹⁹ Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, ²⁰ idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, ²¹ envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. ²² But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, ²³ gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law. ²⁴ And those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

What bothers me most about this twist is in making these fruits law, she is rejecting that these are the works of the 3rd Person of the Trinity. Not our works…His works. 

But it gets worse. She then goes into some statistics dealing with negative thoughts…(play JAllen clip 3)

Ok, so…over 80% of our thoughts are negative and 90% are repetitive from the day before. Meaning we are thinking the same toxic thoughts over and over again. I find this quite interesting. Are any of these negative thoughts related to sins we have committed? That in some form we talk down to ourselves because of guilt? But how was this determined? What is considered a negative thought? A thought to myself that might say “I can’t do such and such…” may seem negative, but may be true. Then again it may also be a chance for the power of God to be thought and meditated on…But notice where she is going with this…she connects negative thought with an “enemy”. (Play JAllen clip 4) 

She then relays her story on how she went through 18 months of doubting God. But again this portion of Scripture is not about doubt, it’s about putting to death the deeds of the flesh. Obeying God’s Law through the power of the Spirit because Christ is in us. The same power that raised Christ from the grave lives in us to actually help us obey God, albeit not perfectly, but it is the goal of the mind and the heart to submit to God. 

We are now 16 min in and she now grabs her bible opens it up and says this: (play JAllen clip 5)

Ok, couple of things going on in this clip:

Let’s start with the good. Amen, Salvation is God’s work, and our faith is a gift from Him and as Christ says in John 6:37 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out. Reformed theology describes this doctrine as the perseverance of the saints. A very comforting doctrine derived from Scripture.

But I want to look at the passage in John 8 that she went to. Because she’s using this passage to say that the devil comes in the dark to give us lies when we don’t pay attention. Is John 8:44 saying this as well?

Remember how she talked about freedom? It’s wonderful how God’s word is, because it is in John 8 that Jesus talks about being set free. Let’s put the verse back in context and look at it and see if Jesus is talking about the thoughts in our minds. Read John 8:31-47)

¹ So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, ³² and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.” ³³ They answered him, “We are offspring of Abraham and have never been enslaved to anyone. How is it that you say, ‘You will become free’?”

³⁴ Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who practices sin is a slave to sin. ³⁵ The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. ³⁶ So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed. ³⁷ I know that you are offspring of Abraham; yet you seek to kill me because my word finds no place in you. ³⁸ I speak of what I have seen with my Father, and you do what you have heard from your father.”

³⁹ They answered him, “Abraham is our father.” Jesus said to them, “If you were Abraham’s children, you would be doing the works Abraham did, ⁴⁰ but now you seek to kill me, a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God. This is not what Abraham did. ⁴¹ You are doing the works your father did.” They said to him, “We were not born of sexual immorality. We have one Father—even God.” ⁴² Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I came from God and I am here. I came not of my own accord, but he sent me. ⁴³ Why do you not understand what I say? It is because you cannot bear to hear my word. ⁴⁴ You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks out of his own character, for he is a liar and the father of lies. ⁴⁵ But because I tell the truth, you do not believe me. ⁴⁶ Which one of you convicts me of sin? If I tell the truth, why do you not believe me? ⁴⁷ Whoever is of God hears the words of God. The reason why you do not hear them is that you are not of God.”

This passage starts with Jesus contrasting His disciples with the disciples of Satan. Those who abide in Jesus’ word are His disciples because it is the truth and it will set them free. Jesus, talking to the Pharisees, describes them as being enslaved to the devil, slaves to their sin because they practice sin. And that if they loved God they would love Him. But they do not because they are of their father the devil, who is a liar and the father of lies. So the truth is in relation to God’s word, and specifically the truth that Jesus is the Messiah, the Son of God. While those who do not believe in Christ and do not abide in His word are believing the lie of Satan. And in believing Satan they will die in their sins, but not only that, but they (the pharisees) are like their father Satan who is a murderer, as they seek to kill Christ. 

So this verse is not in relation to our doubts and negative thoughts that enter our mind in the dark.

Here’s the thing, tho. By introducing an enemy, something outside of ourselves, she rejects that it is our flesh that is the problem. This may allow a person who sets their mind on the flesh to continue to set their mind on the flesh, aka live in sin, yet believe they are setting their mind on the Spirit by merely thinking positive thoughts. 

The other issue with this is that she does not differentiate between negative thought and LIES. These are two different things. Negative thoughts can be subjective. WHat one person takes negatively another may not. But lies…lies are objective, they are lies regardless how one takes them or feels about them. By connecting evil behind negative thoughts without making a distinction that negative thoughts DO NOT necessarily mean LIES, she has made a way for a person to reject truth in claiming the “negative thought” is from the evil one.  

Here’s an example: I feel called to preach a sermon to a mixed congregation at a Sunday morning church service and have been invited by my pastor to do so. In preparation for my sermon, a thought comes to my mind that I shouldn’t be doing this, that it’s not right, that I am a woman and I am unqualified. I label these “negative thoughts” and identify them as coming from Satan to keep me from accomplishing God’s will. After all He put this desire in my heart, right?

See what I did there. I decide what is negative and positive. And in my sin, what I want to hear is always deemed positive. But the real question is: Is it true? She identifies negative thoughts as coming from the enemy and He is a liar therefore the negative thoughts are lies. This is a problem.

Does Romans 8:5-8 talk about an enemy that presents negative thoughts to us? No…it does not talk about an enemy outside of us, but is talking about our own flesh, our very nature, as we are enemies against God living in unrighteousness and ungodliness and under sin (Rom. 3:9-10; 5:10). All throughout Romans Paul is making clear that all of mankind are sinners and will one day stand guilty before God because we suppress the truth in unrighteousness and in that suppression follow our flesh and transgress against God’s Holy Law. The case that Paul is making is that we are under sin guided by our flesh, and the battle in the context of Rom.8:5-8 is with our flesh, our sinful nature not an enemy outside of ourselves who presents us with negative thoughts, but our own flesh that presents us with sin.

She then asks the question: what is the fight and how are we going to fight? Her answer is that we set the mind on the Spirit. Here’s where she explains what it means to set the mind on the Spirit means: (Play clip 6)

Yes! This is very true. But…Rom 8:5-8 is a bit more specific than merely focusing on God. Setting the mind on the Spirit is setting the mind on God, but the text explains what it means to set the mind on the Spirit- to put to death the deeds of the flesh. Going back to verse 6 : For to set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace. ⁷ For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God’s law; indeed, it cannot. ⁸ Those who are in the flesh cannot please God. In the context of Romans to set our mind in the Spirit is to set our mind on God, yes, but more specifically, to set our minds  on obeying His commands, to submit to God’s law. 

After referencing 2 Corinthians 10:4 (really only reading half of the verse) to point to the spiritual battle as a battle of the mind and our lack of knowledge of God. She makes a good point that we tend to buy the lie of self help books, instead of looking at Jesus.

And now she will lead us into the weapons she will give us to fight this spiritual battle so that we may set our minds on the spirit. (Play clip 9)

So our first weapon is The Word of God (what is true). But she doesn’t clarify that Scripture is that word. 

The second weapon is The Spirit of God who brings possibility or capacity beyond anything we can imagine. Relays a story of what she does now when woken up in the middle of the night- she rebukes Satan and then prays for missions). This is her example of the Holy Spirit bringing possibility?…but where is the reliance on the word of God? The Holy Spirit does not bring possibility to our lives, but faith, understanding of God’s word, repentance, and fruit in keeping with repentance- obedience to His word. In fact, this is what Romans 8 is about: the role and power of the Holy Spirit in the believer’s life.

Her third weapon is the People of God. That we should confess our thoughts to others so they will bring the word of God- again not clarifying that the Word of God is Scripture.

My question is: does Scripture give us weapons to use to fight spiritual battles? Yes. It does. God in his grace gave us his very words IN Scripture to thoroughly equip us for EVERY good work. Do those good works include fighting and wrestling with spiritual issues? Yes, in Ephesians 6:10-20. The Holy Spirit through the apostle Paul is very clear what weapons and armor we are to equip ourselves with to “stand against the schemes of the devil” (verse 11). These weapons are the “belt of truth”, the “breastplate of righteousness” (clothed with Christ as He is our righteousness (1 Corin. 1:30), “shoes for our feet” (the readiness to give an answer for the hope that is within us- 1 Pet.3:15), the “shield of faith to extinguish all the flaming darts of the evil one”, the “helmet of salvation” (the Gospel applied to us), and the “Sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God”. And with God’s mighty armor we are… praying at all times in the Spirit, with all prayer and supplication. To that end, [keeping] alert with all perseverance, making supplication for all the saints, (all who boldly proclaim the mystery of the Gospel -verse 18&19). We also have Christ’s example in the wilderness (Luke 4:1-13) where we see Him fight temptation from Satan with faith and strength in the Word of God. 

While I wouldn’t say Mrs. Allen’s weapons are unbiblical, I wonder why she doesn’t give us what Scripture says. Besides this there is the issue that Romans 8 verses 5-8 doesn’t talk about weapons we need to fight a spiritual battle with an enemy who presents us with negative thoughts.

She goes into how her friends helped her fight her spiritual battle with prayer and fasting, and then goes into another story on her daughter dealing with learning disabilities and the struggle she had in school. She uses this story to describe how we believe 3 fundamental lies: (play clip 11)

So notice first, where she got these lies: her counselor friend. I am worthless, I am helpless, and I am unlovable. Are these actually lies tho? 

Now she presents and addresses these lies in her book. I went through these, I believe on episode, either 14 or 15, from Season 1 of Thoroughly Equipped. I basically showed how these are not really lies, and that Scripture explains our wretchedness and complete need for Christ in these things. So to answer that question you can check those episodes out.

This is why she is giving this message and not actually addressing the text. Because it will promote her book. I know that sounds presumptive of me, but why else has she NOT really addressed the Rom.8 text? 

Right after this she gives an example of how a worry of hers is related to one of these lies.(Play clip 12)

I really appreciate that she points to Scripture saying it has answers when wrestling with these thoughts. But I wonder about her applications of the Scriptures in regards to wrestling with these thoughts. Is Scripture a resource we can go to combat negative thoughts with encouragements such as :”You are not helpless, you have the Holy Spirit, God equips you for every good work”, etc. The Scriptures also say we are helpless, it is God that works both in and through us to do good works, And that in our weakness or helplessness it is God who helps, He is our Helper, because we are helpless. She uses Scripture like these to combat the 3 lies in the exact same way. Notice also, WHO the emphasis is on when we tell ourselves “I am not helpless because I have the Holy Spirit. God equips ME for every good work”, etc. The emphasis is on ourselves and boosts ourselves. That’s the problem with taking verses like these, taken out of context, to recite to ourselves when we feel unconfident or helpless. Our confidence should rest on God. Meditating on His character, and the work He has done and is doing. Even the verse that she is using to combat the “lie” that she is helpless is saying that God is doing the equipping, that He prepared these works for us to do. The emphasis is on Him. It’s ok to memorize verses, I heartily encourage that. I would only urge women to understand why those verses are true and who they are really about. God. 

So I might encourage women who wrestle with feeling helpless with this:

‘Yes, we are helpless, but God is our Helper, and He has given us the Holy Spirit to equip us for every good work that He prepared for us to walk in. Let us go to His word and trust that He will guide us, through the Holy Spirit unto wisdom in guiding our children. Not only this but let us appeal to God who can grant our children wisdom and understanding. May He be their great Helper as well.” 

One way of using the Scriptures puts trust and glory in ourselves the other appeals to God and puts trust and gives all glory to him.

And that’s pretty much the end of her message.

 Extremely subtle twists take place here as she describes “setting our minds on the things of the Spirit” as fighting the enemy who attacks us with negative thoughts. But that is not what Rom 8:5-8 is saying. The passage is making it clear that to set the mind on the Spirit is to pursue the things of God, Christ, the Gospel, and His law. She claims that it is the enemy that brings negative thoughts, or doubts; but that is not found in the romans text. This can draw people to believe that the problem is outside of themselves and not actually rooted in their sin or lack of faith, which is what Paul is addressing. She gives weapons to fight this “spiritual battle” with the enemy (which are very general weapons). She does not give the weapons laid out for us very clearly in Scripture. And while she encourages us to look to Scripture for truth, her encouragement is more self centered than God centered.

And that’s it for today’s episode. Out of 8 sessions from the IF:Gathering’s 2020 Conference we went through the first 2 portions of Rom.8, verses 1-4 with a message given by Jada Edwards and verse 5-8 with a message given by Jennie Allen. In the next episode we will look at Rom. 8:9-11 with a message given by the very popular speaker, Beth Moore; and verses 14-17 with a message given by Jo Saxon. We will again look at theses verses in context and examine how these speakers handle the text and who or what they preach about.

Until next time…I pray you are diving into ALL of Romans, as it is so theologically thick and rich. That you are examining your own sinful nature, how you were or are rebellious against a holy God and that you, by the grace of God through the power of the Holy Spirit, were brought to repentance and trust in the finished work of Christ. I pray that you see Christ given to you through the epistle of Romans as your only hope and the greatest display of God’s gift of love for you. And that if you know Christ, you are once again reminded of this Gospel and walk in the glory of it today and everyday forward. And if you don’t know it, that you do.

I pray…you are in His word.

MelbaToast